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This from a student rally on Prop 8 outside Capo Valley High School in Mission Viejo last week:
[photo by Ken Steinhardt, The Orange County Register]
Posted at 08:28 AM in Politics | Permalink
Finally. That's great. This whole prop 8 thing has been so stressful. You should see all the signs at Yorba Linda and Imperial. Its really sad.
Derek Rishmawy |
November 04, 2008 at 01:11 PM
It's that way no matter what city you live in across the country. People are exercising their right to free speech by holding up signs at intersections. It was that way when I lived in Washington too. I don't think it's sad at all. I'm glad to see that people are so passionate about something (like Prop 8) to get out and show their feelings. This world is so worried about trying to squash a different point of view and that is what is sad.
Speaking of Prop 8, another sad thing is the opponents of Prop 8 turning this into a discrimination thing thing which it really isn't at all. It's about defining marriage. That's it. Nothing more, nothing less. Without getting on a political or religious rant, how do you think that God would define marriage. If Jesus were walking here right now, would he say about marriage? I'm not going to answer that since I'm already starting to sound like an Evangelical and think the answer is pretty clear, but still....
November 04, 2008 at 02:20 PM
I wonder what Jesus would say about the divorce rate amongst Christian if he was walking here right now. How does that define marriage... but then again I guess that's ok cause they are not gay.
November 04, 2008 at 08:12 PM
I think God has already made it clear what he would say about the divorce rate among Christians (or anyone else for that matter).
November 04, 2008 at 09:53 PM
Steve: The exercise of free speech and difference of opinion is nice and all but the ugliness and the hate isn't. For a lot of the people, being a witness for Jesus wasn't the first priority in their political practice and its come out in a lot of hateful speech and un-Christlike behavior. And believe me, I don't say this as some touchy-feely, doctrinally-weak Christian either. I just happen to care about the means matching up with the ends. God cares as much about how people go about acting on their views as he does which views they hold.
Josh: I think Jesus wouldn't like the divorce rate amongst Christians, or even non-Christians. That's made evident in all three of the Synoptics and even in Paul's teaching on divorce. It also seems safe to say, based on those same sayings in the synoptics, that he wouldn't like gay marriage.
Derek Rishmawy |
November 04, 2008 at 11:10 PM
I would agree that the ugliness and hate isn't right but what I was responding to was the comment on how it was sad that people were holding signs at Imperial and YL of all places. How is holding signs and an intersection showing hate and ugliness?. It was a bunch of people showing their support for Prop 8 and some cars honking in agreement. I've seen it happen plenty in past elections too and nobody comments on that, but the minute Prop 8 is brought up, it's suddenly hateful and ugly, or sad?
I also agree that God cares about how people act about their views as well as the views they hold. There's a right way and a wrong way to do it, which I think was your point.
November 05, 2008 at 07:21 AM
Derek: So you gave your Biblical views on divorce. What are your non-doctrinally-weak Christian views on gay marriage?
November 05, 2008 at 07:30 AM
Steve, thanks for your response.
First: I'm only 22 so I haven't seen as many elections as you probably have. I have to say, I've never seen signs and stuff like that in elections in Yorba Linda, though. Its a pretty mild town. Beyond that, its not just signs really, its everything else that was going on with it, the rude conversations, the insults being yelled out, and all the stuff that went along with the issue. It was especially disgusting to hear about alleged Christians calling the No on 8 people "fags" and telling them that "gays are going to hell" and other shining examples of Christian love. It was also weird to hear about the vandalism done to Yes on 8 peopes' houses. This is more what I meant.
As for my "non-doctrinally weak Christian view on gay marriage", I believe I already at least hinted at them above when I responded to Josh saying: "It also seems safe to say, based on those same sayings in the synoptics, that he [Jesus] wouldn't like gay marriage."
Hope that clarifies it for you.
Derek Rishmawy |
November 05, 2008 at 08:02 AM
No problem Derek, thanks for your response.
I actually saw the demonstration that you were talking about (I live in Yorba Linda too) and I didn't see the insults and rude conversations that you are referring too. What I saw was pretty mild, like Yorba Linda is. Just the signs and horn honking. I would agree thought that if those insults were being hurled out as you say then there is no place for that. That would be sad and uncalled for.
We actually had a house on our street that was vandalized for having a Yes on 8 sign too, so I know what you are talking about. Who would have though in YL of all places.
Anyway, like you, I'm glad it's over (for now). I'm afraid we haven't seen the last of it and inevitably something like Prop 8 will go down one way or the other. The judges (or world for that matter) won't let it stand long term.
November 05, 2008 at 09:36 AM
I saw the crowds on YL/Imperial (and others too). And I know many people who held signs (both people who held up "Yes" and "No" signs). And I do have to say that both sides were flipped off, yelled out, cussed out, etc. by other people. I think excercising free speech is beautiful. Flipping people off and cussing them out because they believe different than you is ugly.
And that goes for both sides.
Scott Buttes |
November 05, 2008 at 08:43 PM
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